Big Interview: Ugandans are beneficiaries of corruption in the country- Burora

The reports implicating ministers and other government officials in receiving iron sheets meant for the vulnerable people in Karamoja sub region has once again sparked off public calls to the end of corruption in the country.  

 This is not the first time the debate is coming up.

 While speaking to the Nile Post in an interview, the deputy Resident City Commissioner (RCC) Rubaga Division, Herbert Anderson Burora claimed Ugandans are not willing to fight corruption, adding that most of these officials implicated in such scandals are in most cases protected by the public.

Excerpts below:

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Who is Herbert Anderson Burora?  

My name is Herbert Anderson Burora. Right now, I am a public servant but I came into leadership in 2010 as a youth leader in Wakiso district through the national youth council structures in Namulanda which is my village, that is Kajjansi town council.

Around 2011 ,2012 I think that is when I started activism both as a youth leader but also engaging in different issues. By then I had an activist group called “Concerned Citizen”. I still have it. It is where I did a lot of advocacies, especially speaking against corruption and individuals who indulge in things that are not in public interest but they hold public offices. This is where people came to affiliate me with jobless brotherhood.

What prompted you to form this activism group?

Naturally, I am a concerned person. I get concerned about a lot of things but my concern is majorly on public affairs. There is a way I think public issues should be handled and how public work should be done and if one is not concerned, then there is no way you can have a thinking or even criticise what is wrong and also appreciate what is right.

 I am one person who believes that in society we all believe, we behave, we act differently. Whether I am charged with the responsibility, I should work in the interest of the public not in my own interest. So Concerned Citizen was basically to raise issues of public interest.

Why is the group no longer vibrant?

There are so many young people there though not active now because of the changing times. If you look at activism in 2013 up to around 2017, it was so active in every corner, religious leaders, youth leaders themselves. I think that was the most problematic youth council and you league of the NRM.

The Uganda Young Democrats were fading because key people had gotten responsibility elsewhere. People can now do activism on their phone through social media.

The social media was not so escalated as it is now. Then, activism required physical presence, it required delivery of a message in a hard way for it to reach where it should go. The times have changed from physical to social media.  

Why were you affiliated with jobless brotherhood?

Then, the jobless brotherhood was the dominant group. It had an advantage over us because of the way they did their things. Actually, for your information when I got this job, they were not happy because I was a little bit active and I was reliable in activism. You see, these are groups that belong to different political parties.

This jobless brother is affiliated to FDC, I have never been in FDC. I have never been affiliated to any political party save for NRM. For different intentions the chairperson of the jobless brotherhood threatened to come and throw pigs at my office in Nakawa (before being transferred to Rubaga). As much as I am a little bit radical, I don’t believe that I can tag a Muslim person as a pig. I disagree. I have never been in a jobless brotherhood.

What inspired you into leadership and politics?

What inspired me into leadership and politics, I had an opportunity to serve in the church. By the way I am a good preacher and teacher of the bible. I can do both but basically, I prefer teaching because it touches the gist of the convictions and the realities of spiritual and physical life. While preaching is excitement and giving hope, teaching is strengthening the faith. So, I saw there was a gap that in politics we have so many people who were self-seekers. They come to serve their own interest. There are few people who are ready to offer leadership that is straight and in public interest.

 

You talked of fighting corruption as part of your activism, in your view do you think the regime is still capable of fighting the vice with the ongoing scandal in the office of the prime minister regarding iron sheets.

At some point I think corruption is poverty. Poverty is not lack of money but it is in the background where one thinks they have one year to achieve what they have not achieved, to achieve what their grandparents did not achieve and even their parents. So, they develop greed. I also think that we need now to come out strongly. If we are saying the government has failed to fight corruption, why is it that corrupt people keep coming to leadership? We tackle it at the level of postmortem. We forgot there was a cause. Yes, we want to fight corruption is the public willing to fight corruption.

Why do you think the public is not willing to fight corruption?  

The public is not willing, the public is not supportive. The public is the beneficiary because they have not asked me where I got these iron sheets. Maybe the public is also not sensitised. You cannot impose corrupt leaders on people who are tired of corruption. It cannot happen. Corruption now benefits.  So, it is the public that is compromising the fight against corruption. For instance, if the public was tired, (we would be in position to fight the vice in the country).

The iron sheet scandal has also not spared President Museveni who has been for the past few years advocating for zero-tolerance to corruption  

We should understand the president. He has indirectly shown you that we can fight corruption. For example, the iron sheet scandal. Who exposed them?  It is agencies but the president does not want to go directly into war with people (the public who are compromising the fight against corruption). You see corruption is so sophisticated, one will have the moral authority to go in public, to go in the news, television even when they have such scandals and nothing will happen to them. On the iron sheets is not even corruption but abuse of office because they were bought but the manner through which these iron sheets were distributed.

 Do you support the notion that all ministers who were implicated in this scandal should resign?

I want them to be given an opportunity of natural justice. There are so many things to look at but they should be given an opportunity to be heard, sacking or resigning is not the solution but also it is a lesson. It is like when we are here and there is someone who is hiding here who is a thief and we all get arrested but all so with the thief. So, they all put us on the same charge sheet because we have been found where there is a thief but we were doing something different. So, we should be able to explain ourselves to ascertain whether we were part of the group or not. This issue should be able to teach us that if you want something, how do you get it? I fault the minister of Finance (Matia Kasaija) for failing to monitor what he had appropriated and released (the money). So, I accused him of being negligent. The idea of saying (he) didn’t request is an accusable on his part.

What are some of the challenges you have encountered so far in line with your duties?

The challenges are quite enormous but one of which is key is resetting the status core. There is a way we are used to doing things the wrong way and there is a way things should be done. Dealing with the big shots who don’t want to follow protocol, they want to do the things the way they want. So, dealing with the connected, the powerful and the privileged is a very big thing. I find it ill that KCCA sends so many young people to prison who are fighting for life without offering alternatives but you have big people who are stealing money in the same institution. To me before I engaged the vendor, am I clean?

What message to have for young people who are battling with the issue of unemployment in the country?

Unemployment is a general issue and I think the government is making sure it does what it means. Jobs now are no longer official; the competition is high. I think young people should be directed when they are still young into technical work. The government needs to look deeper and further to make sure it looks at the issue of export. It will help to increase our competitions but that will also help the young people. Globally young people start in factories where they can gain experience. They can be able to grow through ranks or get experience and go and do something else on their own.

Lastly, what is your political ambition?

I had an opportunity to be appointed but my ambition for elective politics dwindles every day because I think I may not do much because the public doesn’t want much. They want someone who is going to go for burial, who will give them 10,000. To me those are postmortem. I should be able to create an environment where you can be able to take your children to school without bothering me.  You see URA tax each and everything but without improving, without listening. Your tax base should not be on who you are taxing but it should on what you are taxing. I think in elective politics I would not do much, I would want to create, listen, understand and move with people. If I leave this office, I might choose to go for activism.